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Les Crispi
Fake visions for a fake pope.
Facts Not Lies
Looks like poke Frances is a waxworks dummy.
mccallansteve
Medjugorje is Satanic fraud.
philosopher
The Medjugorje Seers seem to be living nice secular lives, now. None of them went into the religious life.
가입을 원합니다
Medjugorie Pilgrim is just for Bosnian tourist business.
Defeat Modernism
Medjugorje is clearly a false apparition promoting masonic ecumenism and new age evil. This video explains youtu.be/3rLF153eUd0
Live Mike
To all defenders of the Medjugorje "cash cow":

Traditionally, and in keeping with the principle of subsidiarity, the judgement of the ordinary of the diocese (the local bishop) has always been the standard for approbation or condemnation of an apparition. In the case of Medjugorje, the Bishop of Mostar did something unique, powerful and significant.

In this letter to Mr. Thierry Boutet (the …More
To all defenders of the Medjugorje "cash cow":

Traditionally, and in keeping with the principle of subsidiarity, the judgement of the ordinary of the diocese (the local bishop) has always been the standard for approbation or condemnation of an apparition. In the case of Medjugorje, the Bishop of Mostar did something unique, powerful and significant.

In this letter to Mr. Thierry Boutet (the editor [secretary general] of Famille Chrétienne), the ordinary of the Diocese of Mostar (Bishop Ratko Peric), in which Medjugorje is located, says he judges the alleged apparitions to be False and Not Supernatural.
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Mostar October 2, 1997
Protocol Number: 1267/97

Honorable Mr. Boutet,

I am answering your letter of September 29, 1997 received by fax from the Nunciature of Sarajevo […]

On the basis of the serious study of the case by 30 of our ‘studiosi’ [academics] (well three Commissions), on my episcopal experience of five years in the Diocese, on the scandalous disobedience that surrounds the phenomenon, on the lies that are at times put into the mouth of the “Madonna”, on the unusual repetition of “messages” of over 16 years, on the strange way that the “spiritual directors” of the so-called “visionaries” accompany them through the world making propaganda of them, on the practice that the “Madonna” appears at the “fiat” (let her come!) of the “visionaries”,


my conviction and position is not only non constat de supernaturalitate [the supernaturality is not proven] but also the other formula constat de non supernaturalitate [the non-supernaturality is proven] of the apparitions or revelations of Medjugorje [...]

(Signed and affixed with the Episcopal Seal)
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"constat de non supernaturalitate" means:
– the non-supernaturality is proven
– it is evident to be of non-supernatural origin
– it is established not supernatural

Q.E.D. - quod erat demonstrandum
petrus100452
@Live Mike: Poor bishop with such poor judgment. Fortunately, many - with better judgment - did recognize the supernatural nature of the apparitions.
Live Mike
Ding - Round 2 ... I kindly ask the reader to refer our prior exchange on this subject Schönborn: Vatican Has Recognized Medjugorje As A “Shrine”
Starlight777
Vicka pictured with Bishop Peric.
petrus100452
@Defeat Modernisme, @Live Mike, @가입을 원합니다 : What nonsensical comments... show total ignorance or misunderstanding of what has been happening in Medjugorje for 40 years and a complete denial of the many fruits - the greatest fruits anywhere in the Church - that these apparitions of Mary have produced.
Live Mike
@petrus100452 Truth is more important than fruits, my dear fellow.
petrus100452
@Live Mike: Indeed, but you are confusing truth with your own nonsensical thoughts. And by the way, according to the Gospel, good fruits are a sign of truth.
V.R.S.
"the greatest fruits anywhere in the Church"
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Insanity is a very bad fruit.
Live Mike
@petrus100452 Do you reckon an objective material heresy is a good fruit and a sign of truth?
petrus100452
@V.R.S. and @Live Mike: "objective material heresy" in Medjugorje can only be seen by very confused spirits and nowhere in the Church can such a healthy spirit of faith and charity be found as in Medjugorje. You should both visit the place without prejudices and experience the loving presence of Jesus and His Holy Mother.
Live Mike
@petrus100452 Is that a "Yes"?
petrus100452
@Live Mike: Behold how confused you are... I am looking forward to my next visit to Medjugorje and waiting for the secrets that soon will be revealed. And I pray for all those who have denied or even persecuted (with their poisonous words) these apparitions. I grant you the final word in this discussion.
Live Mike
@petrus100452 Thanks for the prayers... You will be in mine as well. May God bless you and Our Lady protect you always. Sincerely yours in the Passion of the Church,
petrus100452
@Live Mike: this comment I do appreciate!
Thomas D
What Bishop Peric wrote is his personal opinion, it has been stated as such by the Vatican. He no longer has any authority in reviewing these apparitions. For while what you say is true in most cases, in this case it is not. In 2010 Pope Benedict XV took it completely out of the locals hands by establishment of the International Commission at the Vatican which published its findings a while back.…More
What Bishop Peric wrote is his personal opinion, it has been stated as such by the Vatican. He no longer has any authority in reviewing these apparitions. For while what you say is true in most cases, in this case it is not. In 2010 Pope Benedict XV took it completely out of the locals hands by establishment of the International Commission at the Vatican which published its findings a while back. There has been much personal animus and lack of objectivity by the bishop, such as seen here in many of these posts, thus it was removed to the International commission.

I think Pope Francis mischaracterized the commissions findings, which were reported inside information in the Italian press and strongly in favor of supernatural first several days of apparitions, and two voting negative on the ongoing apparitions and the others 15 or so saying cannot determine supernatural as of yet.

Fr. Gabrielle Amorth, official exorcist of Rome for many years, before he died, said Medjugorje is a Fortress against Satan, and he can see the pagans not believing in Our Lady coming as the prophets of old, but "be ye Christian" is it unfathomable. Its really like Jesus said if you have ears to hear, many don't and are blinded by false stories and tales on Medjugorje. He also said it is very clear in the gospels by their fruits you will know them. Massive confessions, constant adoration of the blessed sacrament, holy and reverent prayer and masses in many languages. Massive deep conversions, thousands of vocations, etc. He said anyone, priests bishops or whoever that say I will wait and see if the church approves are "fools". This coming from one who performed an estimated 100,000 exorcisms(the minority are possessions). I will trust his discernment of spirits eons more than the very untrained and quite frankly vindictive and bitter interpretations I see here by many.
V.R.S.
@Thomas D
Judging the alleged visions of Medjugorje belonged to jurisdiction of local bishops - Zanic and Peric. Saying that their numerous declarations on the Medjugorje hoax are "personal opinions" - is a lie.
V.R.S.
@petrus100452

"Poor bishop with such poor judgment. Fortunately, many - with better judgment - did recognize the supernatural nature of the apparitions."
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ROTFL.
Live Mike
@Thomas D @V.R.S.
———————————————————————
CONGREGATIO PRO DOCTRINA FIDEI
Protocol Number: 154/81-05922
Citta del Vaticano, Palazzo del S. Uffizio
May 26, 1998

To His Excellency Mons. Gilbert Aubry,
Bishop of Saint-Denis de la Reunion

Excellency:

In your letter of January 1, 1998, you submitted to this Dicastery several questions about the position of the Holy …More
@Thomas D @V.R.S.
———————————————————————
CONGREGATIO PRO DOCTRINA FIDEI
Protocol Number: 154/81-05922
Citta del Vaticano, Palazzo del S. Uffizio
May 26, 1998

To His Excellency Mons. Gilbert Aubry,
Bishop of Saint-Denis de la Reunion

Excellency:

In your letter of January 1, 1998, you submitted to this Dicastery several questions about the position of the Holy See and of the Bishop of Mostar in regard to the so called apparitions of Medjugorje, private pilgrimages and the pastoral care of the faithful who go there.

In regard to this matter, I think it is impossible to reply to each of the questions posed by Your Excellency. The main thing I would like to point out is that the Holy See does not ordinarily take a position of its own regarding supposed supernatural phenomena as a court of first instance. As for the credibility of the "apparitions" in question, this Dicastery respects what was decided by the bishops of the former Yugoslavia in the Declaration of Zadar, April 10, 1991: "On the basis of the investigations so far, it can not be affirmed that one is dealing with supernatural apparitions and revelations." Since the division of Yugoslavia into different independent nations it would now pertain to the members of the Episcopal Conference of Bosnia-Hercegovina to eventually reopen the examination of this case, and to make any new pronouncements that might be called for.

What Bishop Peric said in his letter to the Secretary General of "Famille Chretienne", declaring: "My conviction and my position is not only 'non constat de supernaturalitate,' but likewise, 'constat de non supernaturalitate' of the apparitions or revelations in Medjugorje", should be considered the expression of the personal conviction of the Bishop of Mostar which he has the right to express as Ordinary of the place, but which is and remains his personal opinion.

Finally, as regards pilgrimages to Medjugorje, which are conducted privately, this Congregation points out that they are permitted on condition that they are not regarded as an authentification of events still taking place and which still call for an examination by the Church.

I hope that I have replied satisfactorily at least to the principal questions that you have presented to this Dicastery and I beg Your Excellency to accept the expression of my devoted sentiments.

Archbishop Tarcisio Bertone
Secretary of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith
———————————————————————
The highlighted statement has been distorted by promoters of Medjugorje and presented in such a way as to diminish the authority of the Bishop of Mostor. Yes, the local bishop did give you his opinion... HIS OFFICIAL OPINION as one who would best know the truth of the matter and as the ordinary of the diocese empowered with the official authority of the Catholic Church with the prayerful assistance of the Holy Spirit to render such a decision.
Live Mike
As an aside, it is interesting to note that the very same man (now Cardinal Bertone) who seeks to defend Medjugorje also wants us to forget all about Fatima. Isn't that curious?! @V.R.S.
V.R.S.